Recent Posts by ontrose69

Topic: General / Very important question......

WooHoo! Sounds like Seattle! We all grew up in the Seattle, Washington area. We don't have midgies, but we do have tons of mosquitos!

Topic: General / Very important question......

Scotland? My Dad talks about Scotland all the time and how he wants to go there to the land of his ancestors!

I don't know about having to wait so long for a bowl of milk though... I'd probably forget about it by then! I'd probably eat it anyway though! LOL Does any dog disagree with me? I think not!

Connor

Topic: General / Very important question......

I still love anything that is white. I'll take your mom's milk Tessa! I especially love sour cream!

Connor

Topic: General / Very important question......

Thanks for making us all laugh this morning! I knew something was kind of funny tasting about the milk in my cereal this morning... eww.... the thought of it! Snotty milk!

Connor & gang

Topic: General / Breed specific legislation (BSL), agree or disagree?

I am very opposed to BSL. Rotties, Pits, GS, Dobermans... the list goes on and on. BSL seems to target the breeds that are "popular" and big & strong. Go and visit www.nationalcanineresearchcouncil.com and you'll see why BSL's are not only stupid, but they are basing them on the wrong data entirely. BSL's are just plain ignorant. I work for my local Humane Society and let me tell you... we get tons of Pits. They are some of the best dogs there! And even after being abused, they are still willing to give people a second or third or fourth chance. 'nuff said. WOOF!

Topic: Health, Diet And Vets / Wellness - dog food

All five of our dogs eat Wellness. I prefer it over Inova or any of the other holistic dog foods. Well, at least our kids prefer it!

Topic: Support And Suggestions / What's With Photo Uploads??

I am having the same problem now. I have not had any problems in the past with uploading new pictures. But now, I get the same error as Falina2 does. All of my pictures are .jpg extentions. Any ideas?

Chris

Topic: Fun / 2 Polls

1. For me Rottweilers are my fav. For my wife, Chihuahua's are hers.

2. We have five dogs right now. Always wish we could rescue more though.

Topic: General / Rottweilers are bad and here's proof

Hi everyone!

I have been away from MDS for quite some time, I just happened to come across this forum thread and felt I had to put in my two cents worth. Like others who have posted, I am sorry this one will be so long, but it is the facts and not my emotions that I am presenting and they need lots of space to show my points. It has taken me a couple of days to calm down enough to be able to do this post. I am very surprised that a person who “claims” to be an expert on dogs has posted like this.

First, let me state that I work at my local Humane Society and see quite a variety of dog breeds.

Second, my wife and I have over 70 years of experience between us with dogs of various breeds.

Third, yes, I am a HUGE Rottweiler lover and fan. But I do not let that taint my views on how a dog acts.

Fourth, in the course of the many years of having dogs and being around many others that weren’t mine, I have been bit numerous times. Not once has it been a Rottweiler or another so-called “dangerous” breed of dog.

I am going to address each of Emily’s posts separately and hope I can be as unbiased in my statements as possible. I will list my sources so that the facts are there for anyone to take a look at the original data.

The first thing is your Google search criteria. You can do a search for “attacks” by any breed  and come up with pages and pages of hits. Rottweilers and Pit-type breeds just happen to be some of the most sensational ones you’ll find. There are quite a few factors as to why this is.

• Emily stated that there was a Rottie at the pound that wanted to kill her. Pure speculation. She does not know the dog nor know the past history of it. Also, dogs in a rescue shelter environment are scared because they are in a new place, they don’t know what is happening to them, and they don’t know what their “pack” status is with the other dogs already there.
   
• Emily stated that her neighbor’s Rottie bit her friend and almost killed another dog for no reason. Again, pure speculation. She does not know the motivation behind the attacks.
   
• Emily stated “so you’re telling me that ALL those dogs attacked because of the owner?” Here are the actual facts as presented by the National Canine Research Council on their website at http://www.nationalcanineresearchcouncil.com:

FATAL DOG ATTACKS: THE TRUTH BEHIND THE TRAGEDY

   IT’S THE OWNER, NOT THE DOG  

A National Canine Research Council Year-End Report: 2007 

Extensive research and investigation using 40 years of data has conclusively identified the reckless and criminal ownership practices that can cause a dog to become dangerous:

OWNER MANAGEMENT & CONTROL OF DOGS

Owners failing to humanely contain, control and maintain their dogs (chained dogs, loose roaming dogs, cases of abuse/neglect), and owners failing to properly supervise interaction between children and dogs.

FUNCTION OF DOG

Owners maintaining dogs for guarding/protection, fighting, intimidation/status, or as yard dogs. Such dogs are resident dogs, not family pets.

REPRODUCTION STATUS OF DOG

Owners failing to spay or neuter animals not used for competition, show, or in a responsible breeding program.

Tabulations of fatal dog attacks by breed yield no understanding of human/canine interaction and offer no remedies to enhance community safety. Forty years ago, Pit bulls and Rottweiler’s combined were involved in less than 2% of all fatal attacks.* Nevertheless, one or more of these same critical factors was evident in 90% of all fatal dog attacks during that time.

From 2005-2007, increased focus on the negligent and criminal human behaviors has resulted in 31% of owners and/or parents of young victims being criminally charged.

91% of all fatal dog attacks from 2005-2007 could have possibly been avoided if the owners of these dogs had better control/training, spayed/neutered and/or had not had the dogs for guarding, protection, fighting or intimidation/status.

• Emily stated that she “[knows she’s] right and [has] experience with EVERY shape, size, breed of dog”. Most likely this is a false statement. I am extremely doubtful that any person has had experience with every single breed of dog known today. Even “experts” such as The Dog Whisperer do not have experience with every breed of dog. Rottweilers and Pit-type dogs are showing up in the media for dog bites for several reasons. Fact: 40 years ago, Pit Bulls and Rottweilers combined were involved in less than 2% of all fatal attacks. Why is this different now? Popularity and the media are two reasons. In previous decades, it has been different breeds that have been considered “dangerous”. German Shepherds, Doberman Pinschers, Mastiffs and other breeds have been considered “dangerous” over the last 100 years. The fact that a Dachshund was the cause of a fatality in 1974 doesn’t mean that the breed should be considered “dangerous”, does it? Emily also stated that no other dog is as unpredictable as a Rottweiler. Again, pure speculation on her part. There are far too many factors that can cause a dog (of any breed) to be considered unpredictable. My own example is this: I have been bitten by Aussie Cattle Dogs, Blue Heelers and Aussie Shepherds. This does not mean they are unpredictable breeds or dangerous. I do tend to stay away from those breeds by personal choice. However if you look at my profile, you will see that we actually own an Aussie Cattle Dog.
  
  ·        Emily stated: “No…not every single last Rottweiler is “vicious”...I’ve met…I think 4 that were sweet…BUT they could snap at any moment. They’re very unpredictable.” Once again, pure speculation on her part. Any dog can be unpredictable or snap at any moment, depending on the background and current circumstances of the dog.
  
• Emily stated that Rotties are very unpredictable and they’re responsible for a lot of dog-related deaths. Again, I am quoting directly from The National Canine Research Council’s website:

There has always been a segment of the population that believes breed is the root cause of dog attacks. For whatever reasons, these people seem uninterested in examining the circumstances around the attack itself or refuse to acknowledge that the popularity and increased numbers of these breeds will necessarily be reflected in their "overrepresentation" in reported cases of dog bites.  

However, history clearly bears out that when a certain breed becomes extremely popular in a given time period, and especially when the breed is used by substandard owners for negative functions, these will be the breeds found in reported cases of severe and fatal dog attacks.

The truth is - the incidence and frequency of dog attacks has remained relatively consistent over the last century, regardless of the popularity or involvement of certain breeds of dogs.

The extreme popularity of the German Shepherd during certain decades did not significantly increase the frequency of fatal attacks. Likewise, the immense popularity of the Pit Bull-type dogs and Rottweiler’s during the last two decades has not significantly increased the frequency of fatal attacks.

Fatal Dog Attacks in Arizona as Compared to Other Selected Risks:

Furthermore, according to the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services:

In 2005, twenty-two (22) children in Arizona died as a result of maltreatment.

In a SINGLE YEAR, 2005, more than THREE TIMES as many children died from maltreatment (abuse/neglect) than the TOTAL of ALL dog attacks in Arizona over the past 43 years.

So, are dogs a real danger? In fact, people in Arizona routinely accept far greater risks from ATVs, bicycles and swimming pools than any that are associated with companion animals.

Emily stated “Anyway, you proved no point. I found more actual Rottweiler attacks…why? Because they attack more…why ? Because they’re not pets and are extremely unpredictable.” Her “facts” are not accurate. There are more dog bites that go unreported than there are those that get reported. The media tends to pick up the ones that are a “sensational” story. There is also the fact that Rotties, Pits and other large/giant breed dogs are stronger and will cause more damage when they do bite.

Again, my information comes from the National Canine Research Council.

The Media: A Reliable Source of Information on Dog Attacks?

Everything is a Pit bull, whether it is or not:  Again

On June 4, 2008, at least 29 news articles were run on a story about a Los Angeles boy "mauled by a Pit bull."  Some of the headlines were:

·         "LA toddler hospitalized after being mauled by Pit bulls" - Fresno Bee

·         "2-year-old stable after pit bull bites his face" -  LA Times

The Mercury News even reported that two Pit bulls attacked the child. Another article described the dog as the "family Pit bull."  The Los Angeles Times reported the boy in "critical condition after he was bitten by a pit bull."

Perhaps the media should not bear the brunt for this serious error, as the source of the breed mis-identification was found to have originated from the Los Angeles Police Department.

The LAPD should not attempt to identify breeds of dogs or comment on canine behavior. The average police officer is no more skilled in breed identification than is the average reporter. Perhaps in the realization of this, the LAPD later referred all inquiries on the dog involved in this incident to the city's animal services department.

The Los Angeles Department of Animal Services released a statement declaring the dog involved in the attack on the boy was "in fact a shepherd mix."

Note:  Acknowledgement is given to the Los Angeles Times for printing a "For the Record" remark on the erroneous breed identification of the dog in this incident. On June 7th the  LA Times printed the following: "An article in Thursday's California section about a boy attacked by his family's dog quoted authorities as saying the dog was a pit bull. The Los Angeles Department of Animal Services said Friday that the animal that bit the toddler was a shepherd mix."

However, this small retraction cannot possibly undo the damage that was done by the media.  All the headlines run by the LA Times which initially identified this dog to be a Pit bull have not been pulled and can still be found in the LA Times archives.

Additionally, more than one attorney website and dog bite "advocacy" website has picked up this "Pit bull attack" story and posted it on their website as additional "evidence" of the nature of Pit bulls.

The point I am trying to make is that it is not the breed of dog that is “bad”, but that there are many factors as to why a dog will bite someone.

Emily stated “Oh,yes I am considered an expert.If I told you how old I was, you would most likely look over me and think I’m some punk kid looking for trouble or something, but no again…I am actually considered an expert. I could answer just about any question you throw at me about dogs.” I may definitely be wrong, but it is very uncommon in today’s world for a “kid” to be an expert in any given field. Also, experts I know and have met, regardless of what field their expertise is in, do not go around making sure that everyone around them knows they are an expert in that field. Granted, there are exceptions, as with anything. Even with all my years of experience I do not consider myself an expert on dogs. Knowledgeable? Yes. Webster’s Dictionary defines expert as “having, involving, or displaying special skill or knowledge derived from training or experience.” I am not saying that a teenager cannot have experience in a given field, but that it would be extremely limited. This would contradict Emily’s earlier statement of having experience with all breeds.

Emily stated “So, how am I considered an expert at my age (I’m under 20, older than 13) Well, where to begin?! I have at this time three dogs of my own, whom I have taught everything they know. I make sure they’re healthy, I got them on a diet I created myself, I have a notebook especially for recording their waist sizes, weight, etc. I have another notebook for dog information…a 5 subject notebook and I’m on the 3rd section of it and it’s been a little more than 2 months…what do I write in it?Well, I just finished all the AKC dates…now I’m going by groups, etc…like I said this is really hard to explain. I have shown dogs,not for a long time, but 2 years…I’ve done all my grooming, no help…” Emily has experience; however experience alone does not equate to expertise. Wikipedia’s definition of expert reads:

An "expert"  is someone widely recognized as a reliable source of technique or skill whose faculty for judging or deciding rightly, justly, or wisely is accorded authority and status by their peers or the public. An expert, more generally, is a person with extensive knowledge or ability in a particular area of study. Experts are called in for advice on their respective subject, but they do not always agree on the particulars of a field of study. An expert can be, by virtue of training, education, profession, publication or experience, believed to have special knowledge of a subject beyond that of the average person, sufficient that others may officially (and legally) rely upon the individual's opinion. Historically, an expert was referred to as a sage. The individual was usually a profound philosopher distinguished for wisdom and sound judgment.

A true expert would be expected to have the credentials necessary to testify in a court of law as to their field of study, research and experience. With more experience and education, Emily may well become an expert in the field of dogs.  However, experts are not experts merely because they self-declare themselves to be an expert. That status is accorded only by their peers or the public. I certainly don’t see that status being given out by the peers and public on MDS.

Emily stated “I didn’t want attention…I wanted to point out how bad the breed is…and we somehow got on the subject of my expertise!” I am pretty sure if I made a remark like the opening one on this forum that I would be attracting a great deal of attention and my credentials would also be called into question. When a person states an opinion as fact, they are by the very nature of their statement asserting themselves as an expert. It should come as no surprise that her experience, background and expertise are called into question.

In conclusion, making broad and sweeping statements about a specific breed without the actual knowledge and experience of the breed is rather irresponsible. Any dog can and will bite under the right circumstances regardless of breed. Which brings me to BSL (Breed Specific Legislation). BSL in my opinion is very irresponsible. There is no actual evidence that one breed or another should be considered “dangerous” based on the number of dog bites. Again, quoting from the National Canine Research Council:

There is no evidence that breed-specific legislation has been effective in reducing the frequency or severity of attacks in any community, city, county or country.

However, canine aggression continues to be viewed by many as a breed specific trait and lawmakers and politicians persist on introducing dangerous dog legislation as a breed specific issue.

In addition to the fact that there is no evidence of the effectiveness of BSL, some politicians, in the process of defending their positions on the "dangerousness" of Pit Bulls, have made statements about fatal dog attacks and Pit Bulls that have no factual documentation.

Unsubstantiated claims about the number of fatal attacks and the breeds involved in these incidents are becoming more frequent. Since, no other professional national agency is presently researching fatal dog attacks, erroneous statistics and comments from lawmakers are going unchallenged, thereby making it necessary for the NCRC to address factual errors about Pit Bulls, canine behavior, and dog attacks.

I am not picking on Emily as a person, but I feel that if a person is going to make comments that will inflame others, then they have a responsibility to make sure that their facts are correct.

Topic: Breeds Club / Rottweilers

Topic: Fun / Dog Names word game.

Topic: Fun / Dog Names word game.

Topic: Fun / Dog Names word game.

Topic: Breeds Club / Rottweilers

Topic: Breeds Club / Rottweilers

Topic: Breeds Club / Rottweilers

Topic: Rescues, Shelters And Adoptions / Free ads for rescue groups

Topic: Support And Suggestions / pictures

Topic: Breeds Club / Rottweilers

Topic: Breeds Club / Rottweilers

Topic: Breeds Club / Rottweilers

Topic: Fun / Dog Names word game.

Topic: Fun / Dog Names word game.

Topic: Rescues, Shelters And Adoptions / abandoned dogs

Topic: General / Breed Legislation in Dublin